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Garbage TDK Discs

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Garbage TDK Discs

Postby Joker on Sat Feb 01, 2003 9:28 pm

I have a Lite-On 40X, with the latest firmware, and am finding that its almost impossible to get a decent disc off the TDK 40X discs. I had no problem with the 32X TDK's, but these 40X discs are really bad. I've burned 3 discs error free, and gone through half the 50 pack to do it. Other discs resulted in anywhere up to 61.5% damaged [sectors?] with Nero CD Speed. I've never had results this bad with ANY disc. I even tried lowering the burn speed, and that actually increased the errors (or it was chance that those were my worst burns). Last time I buy TDK. I remember how good the real TDK manufactured discs (in their own U.S. plant) were. Its a shame.

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Postby tlotz on Sat Feb 01, 2003 10:03 pm

You are 100% correct. Currect TDK CD-R media is made by either Ritek or CMC Magnetics, and since both companies are known to make poor quality disks, problems like what you have experienced are likely to happen. If you want *great* 40X CD-R media that even burns perfectly at 48X, buy 40X (or better) certified media made by Taiyo Yuden. Taiyo Yuden media is always made in Japan--so it is easy to find in the stores. My favorite quality CD-R media is the Maxell CD-R Pro disks sold at Best Buy in 10 packs for $8.99 and 25-pack spindles for $14.99. These disks are also sold at Office Depot and Staples, but for a higher price. It must be the *Pro* CD-R disks; Maxell's other disks don't appear to be any better than TDK's. The Maxell CD-R Pro disks are made by Taiyo Yuden, and burn perfectly at 48X (despite the fact that they are rated at 40X). One last thing: I too loved the old made in the USA TDK media, and just recently used the last of it that I had.
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Postby Ian on Sun Feb 02, 2003 12:16 am

I have a spindel of TDK 48x discs that are made by CMC. They are some of the worst CMC discs I've used.
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Postby tlotz on Sun Feb 02, 2003 12:39 am

Ian: I returned a box of the same TDK 48X discs purchased from Circuit City prior to using them for fear of the problem you are having. I returned them based on the horrible reputation that CMC Magnetics' CD-R discs have. If you want good CD-R discs, go for the Taiyo Yuden made CD-R discs. Besides the Maxell CD-R Pro suggestion I made in this topic, Fuji Film CD-R discs and all other CD-R discs labeled "Made in Japan" should be Taiyo Yuden made. I feel that the Maxell CD-R Pro Taiyo Yuden made discs are even better than the old made in the USA TDK discs.
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Postby zbeoch on Sun Feb 02, 2003 3:00 am

Not all CMC made CDR's are bad. I use Imation 48x CDR's and they burn (on my Lite-On 52x24x52) at 48x with no errors and no slowdowns. Earlier Imation CDR's (32x and below; never tried 40x) sucked. Imation has certainly increased the quality of their CDR's. I'm very impressed.
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Postby BuddhaTB on Sun Feb 02, 2003 5:11 am

In my opinion. Imation CD-R's are the only ones from CMC that should be trusted. All other brands made by CMC seem to be of lower quality than the Imation disc. CMC must have a hundred different grades of CD media, as some of their stuff is of really poor quality.
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Postby TheWizard on Sun Feb 02, 2003 6:38 am

tlotz wrote:Currect TDK CD-R media is made by either Ritek or CMC Magnetics, and since both companies are known to make poor quality disks


Eh? I don't know which discs you have tried that are made by Ritek, but they make very good discs. Better than CMC? No doubt, but CMC discs aren't that bad either.
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Postby jase on Sun Feb 02, 2003 5:20 pm

Agreed. The majority of Ritek discs are above-average in quality. Not TY by any means, but I'm able to get average <0.5 C1 errors on Ritek 24x, 40x and 48x media burned at 52x on my LiteOn 52x. Hardly a bad result!!!

I've had some bad experiences with CMC, but mainly due to the fact that the top surface peels rather than write quality. I also get good results from the other large Taiwanese CDR maker, Prodisc.
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Postby UALOneKPlus on Mon Feb 03, 2003 5:59 am

How timely this thread is!!!

I finally got around to opening a pack of TDK 12X 700MB that I bought from CostCo in early 2001. I burned 3 CD-R's at 12X on both my Lite-On 52X and 48X CD-RW's.

These TDK's are ABSOLUTE garbage!!!! :evil: :evil: :evil:

The 1st 2 CD-R's were read by the CD-RW's as AUDIO CD's after a successful write!!!! :o :o The data was absoultely useless!

The 3rd CD-R was only half full of data, and no data was readable!!! I ran Scandisk and it reported 85.96% damaged!!!

I will NEVER buy TDK's ever again. Thank god this was the only TDK media I've ever bought, and it was only a 30 pack, with a CD-R marking pen from CostCo. Pisses me off that I paid $15 for them!!! :evil: :evil:

I'm going to try to take it back to CostCo to see if I get a refund... Wish me luck!
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Postby BillyG on Mon Feb 03, 2003 6:38 am

UALOneKPlus wrote:How timely this thread is!!!

I finally got around to opening a pack of TDK 12X 700MB that I bought from CostCo in early 2001. I burned 3 CD-R's at 12X on both my Lite-On 52X and 48X CD-RW's.

These TDK's are ABSOLUTE garbage!!!! :evil: :evil: :evil:


Where your CD-R's made in Tiawan, USA or Japan? I never had any trouble with those 12X TDK's that were made in the USA and used the dark blue ink. I wish TDK were still making them here too. Are there ANY CD-R manufacturing plants in the USA anymore or did the Tiawanese companies kill them all off?

CMC's quality is very scattershot (especally TDK, Philips and Verbatim). I wont buy ANY CMC made media anymore and I have told my freinds and computer users group not to buy them too, even with a good rebate.

If you have to buy TDK media be sure to get the ones "Made in Japan" - thats almost like the Good Housekeeping symbol to me.

Image

I was looking for a jpg of the TY made TDK cakebox and found this pic of Imations in the UK - it reminds me of a quart of ice cream- Yum.
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Postby UALOneKPlus on Mon Feb 03, 2003 8:10 am

Surprisingly, my TDK's are made in the USA. Yes it does have the blue ink.

When I burned all 3 CD's, and I took a careful look at the data side, I could see wierd "swirl" marks. Kind of like looking at the ocean from space, and you can see "waves" and stuff.

I thought at first it might have been my CD-RW's going bad, as unlikely as that might seem, as I've never had bad experiences like this before with any CD-R media.

So I burned a Imation 12x (that was rated 16x by a sticker) CD-R with the same data, and it came out 100% readable, and 100% error free according to CD Speed.

Wierd that you didn't have any problems, and I'm having so many problems, even though I'm burning them at 12x! :evil:
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Postby Gary Kokkin on Mon Feb 03, 2003 9:56 am

Try TDK Speed-X ,inkjet printable discs . -48x -Made in EU (France)
Very good perfomance


This Disc is designed for CD-RW/COMBO Drive Only.
Disc Type, Material = CD-R, Phthalocyanine
ATIP Lead-in = 97m 15s 05f
Norminal Capacity = 702.83MB (79m 59s 74f)
Disc Manufacturer maybe = TDK M-dye
SMART-BURN Speed Limit = 48X
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Postby UALOneKPlus on Tue Feb 04, 2003 2:33 am

I love Costco!!!! :lol:

I returned the worthless batch of TDK CD-R's without any problem to CostCo tonight for cash back!!

I wish all stores were like CostCo. This is really the best cust svc one could hope to get!
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Postby Joker on Wed Feb 05, 2003 7:07 am

The high quality Made in USA TDK discs were the only discs that were absolute unreadable coasters with on my Lite-On. The discs haven't been made in a while, and as a result, I don't think the firmware had been optimized for them. There are several newer firmware versions now, but I haven't tried again.

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Postby Dartman on Thu Feb 06, 2003 12:14 am

NONE of my Liteon will write proerly to the old dark blue TDK certified+ media that I still have around 35 of. They were the best media you could buy in the days of 12x max burners and almost anything would read them too. Too bad they didn't keep making their own media.
However my new Sony dru500a DVD burner seems to burn them just fine at 24x with low c-1 errors so maybe I'll get to use them again.
My old TDK would burn them at about 20 just fine too but the Liteons don't have a media table for them and the defualt or whatever they use doesn't cut it.
Makes sense though, the media was pretty much gone by the time the 32x drive was out so how can you test it to make the drive burn it properly.
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Postby BillyG on Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:32 am

Dartman wrote:NONE of my Liteon will write proerly to the old dark blue TDK certified+ media that I still have around 35 of. They were the best media you could buy in the days of 12x max burners and almost anything would read them too. Too bad they didn't keep making their own media.


I guess TDK was getting a lot of complaints or returns on the USA Made CD-R's and decided instead of fixing things, they shut down and sold off or converted thier plants. :(

I just did a CD trade with a freind in Spain - he sent me some TDK "Reflex" CD-Rs that were made in Japan. They are made by TDK but use green Cyanine dye instead of the Blue AZO that the USA disks did. I wish TDK were selling these in the USA instead of CMC!!
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Postby KCK on Thu Feb 06, 2003 11:16 am

My Lite-On LTR48125W VS08 behaves very well with TDK d-view 700MB 48x

http://www.tdk-europe.com/products/uk/r ... D-R_d-view

for which SmartBurn 2.1 reports the same info as given above by Garry Kokkin for Speed-X! I guess we are more lucky in Europe. :D
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Postby KCK on Fri Feb 07, 2003 5:17 am

Garry Kokkin:

For the TDK d-view 700MB 48x discs mentioned in my previous post, Nero CD Speed (1.02): Disc Info reports

Manufacturer : TDK
Code : 97m15s05f
Disc Type : CD-R
Usage : General
Recording Layer : Dye Type 5: Short Strategy (Phthalocyanine)
Recording Speed : n/a
Capacity : 159:59.74
1406 MB
Additional Capacity : n/a
Overburn Capacity : not tested

i.e., "doubled" Capacity. Do you get the same result for Speed-X? (Please specify your CD Speed version, OS and burner.)
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Postby arfmonger on Mon Feb 10, 2003 5:49 pm

Some TDKs on the shelves are still TYs. I've bought them as recently as a month ago at a circuit city. Just look for made in japan on the label, or the tell-tale TY screw-top on the cakebox.

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Postby dodecahedron on Sat Feb 22, 2003 8:30 pm

i have some TDK media:
Reflex ULTRA METALLIC (also says on the package: METALLIC DISC)
product code: CD-R80CMEA
certified 24x.

CD Speed Disc Info:

Manufacturer : TDK
Code : 97m15s01f
Disc Type : CD-R
Usage : General
Recording Layer : Dye Type 1: Long Strategy (Cyanine, AZO)
Recording Speed : n/a
Capacity : 79:59.74
703 MB


CDR Identifier:

ATIP: 97m 15s 01f
Disc Manufacturer: TDK Corp.
Reflective layer: Dye (Long strategy; e.g. Cyanine, Azo etc.)
Media type: CD-Recordable
Recording Speeds: min. unknown - max. unknown
nominal Capacity: 702.83MB (79m 59s 74f / LBA: 359849)

this is a european-market product, so no "made in xxxxx" on the box

are these the made in USA TDKs your'e talking about?
are they any good?
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Postby tlotz on Sat Feb 22, 2003 11:05 pm

TheWizard wrote:
tlotz wrote:Currect TDK CD-R media is made by either Ritek or CMC Magnetics, and since both companies are known to make poor quality disks


Eh? I don't know which discs you have tried that are made by Ritek, but they make very good discs. Better than CMC? No doubt, but CMC discs aren't that bad either.


I beg to differ with you. Ritek disks are OK, but, as far as CD media is concerned, they are poor quality. Most people will not have any trouble with Ritek media--but why use Ritek when you can use Taiyo Yuden made discs? TY discs are of much better quality--much better for archival purposes and better for compatibility. But, Ritek discs will satisfy most people's needs. Go to the URL:

http://www.cdmediaworld.com/hardware/cd ... lity.shtml

There are many sources on the 'net that have pushed me away from Ritek media. CMC Magnetics media is generally of poorer quality than Ritek media. So, just buy TY Made in Japan discs, and avoid Ritek and CMC discs all together.
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Postby Joker on Sat Feb 22, 2003 11:13 pm

dodecahedron wrote:i have some TDK media:
Reflex ULTRA METALLIC (also says on the package: METALLIC DISC)
product code: CD-R80CMEA
certified 24x.

CD Speed Disc Info:

Manufacturer : TDK
Code : 97m15s01f

CDR Identifier:

ATIP: 97m 15s 01f
Disc Manufacturer: TDK Corp.

this is a european-market product, so no "made in xxxxx" on the box

are these the made in USA TDKs your'e talking about?
are they any good?


That's the info I get from some of the made in U.S.A. TDK discs with the exception that the ATIP is slightly different, I get:
ATIP: 97m 15s 00f
Disc Manufacturer: TDK Corp.

They were marketed in the U.S. at the time as All Speed Certified Plus.

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Postby jase on Sun Feb 23, 2003 12:02 am

tlotz wrote:
TheWizard wrote:
tlotz wrote:Currect TDK CD-R media is made by either Ritek or CMC Magnetics, and since both companies are known to make poor quality disks


Eh? I don't know which discs you have tried that are made by Ritek, but they make very good discs. Better than CMC? No doubt, but CMC discs aren't that bad either.


I beg to differ with you. Ritek disks are OK, but, as far as CD media is concerned, they are poor quality. Most people will not have any trouble with Ritek media--but why use Ritek when you can use Taiyo Yuden made discs? TY discs are of much better quality--much better for archival purposes and better for compatibility. But, Ritek discs will satisfy most people's needs. Go to the URL:

http://www.cdmediaworld.com/hardware/cd ... lity.shtml

There are many sources on the 'net that have pushed me away from Ritek media. CMC Magnetics media is generally of poorer quality than Ritek media. So, just buy TY Made in Japan discs, and avoid Ritek and CMC discs all together.


With respect, that webpage is ancient now. If you take the new type J 40x/48x Ritek media, or the type K 32x cyanine version, you'll find that if you write it at full speed and then read it back with a LiteOn burner and CD-Doctor, these discs give the lowest C1 error rates I've seen other than Taiyo Yuden. I've been getting typically average C1 error rate of 0.2.

With regards longevity, well I have plenty of 5yo Ritek media that's still fine (and still fairly low C1 error levels as well). The ones that have died tend to be the ones I've left on the window-ledge, and I have to say that the TY discs I've done this to have suffered as well (the edges of the discs turn brown etc).

As for Ritek media being variable, all I can say is I've always bought the cheapest Ritek media I can find and with one or two exceptions (probably due to being burned with grade B media etc) I have never had trouble with any of it. And Ritek media is compatible with a range of CD burners which TY isn't. Aopen writers for a start HATE TY.

I also have to say that their results haven't been realised in any case in some examples. They give TDK type 0 (USA! USA! pffft.....) media a higher rating than Verbatim Metal Azo. Well, I have found this to be a load of cr*p. The hallowed dark blue TDK media often develops errors toward the end of the disc after a few years. They don't react well to sunlight or damp conditions and their C1 error count was high in the first place. The Mitsubishi media fares much better (although the printable top surface is garbage.....)
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Postby dodecahedron on Sun Feb 23, 2003 1:08 am

Joker wrote:That's the info I get from some of the made in U.S.A. TDK discs with the exception that the ATIP is slightly different, I get:
ATIP: 97m 15s 00f
Disc Manufacturer: TDK Corp.

They were marketed in the U.S. at the time as All Speed Certified Plus.

are they the same dye type as the one i mentioned:
Dye Type 1: Long Strategy (Cyanine, AZO) ?
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One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
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Postby tlotz on Sun Feb 23, 2003 2:51 am

jase wrote:
tlotz wrote:
TheWizard wrote:
tlotz wrote:Currect TDK CD-R media is made by either Ritek or CMC Magnetics, and since both companies are known to make poor quality disks


Eh? I don't know which discs you have tried that are made by Ritek, but they make very good discs. Better than CMC? No doubt, but CMC discs aren't that bad either.


I beg to differ with you. Ritek disks are OK, but, as far as CD media is concerned, they are poor quality. Most people will not have any trouble with Ritek media--but why use Ritek when you can use Taiyo Yuden made discs? TY discs are of much better quality--much better for archival purposes and better for compatibility. But, Ritek discs will satisfy most people's needs. Go to the URL:

http://www.cdmediaworld.com/hardware/cd ... lity.shtml

There are many sources on the 'net that have pushed me away from Ritek media. CMC Magnetics media is generally of poorer quality than Ritek media. So, just buy TY Made in Japan discs, and avoid Ritek and CMC discs all together.


With respect, that webpage is ancient now. If you take the new type J 40x/48x Ritek media, or the type K 32x cyanine version, you'll find that if you write it at full speed and then read it back with a LiteOn burner and CD-Doctor, these discs give the lowest C1 error rates I've seen other than Taiyo Yuden. I've been getting typically average C1 error rate of 0.2.

With regards longevity, well I have plenty of 5yo Ritek media that's still fine (and still fairly low C1 error levels as well). The ones that have died tend to be the ones I've left on the window-ledge, and I have to say that the TY discs I've done this to have suffered as well (the edges of the discs turn brown etc).

As for Ritek media being variable, all I can say is I've always bought the cheapest Ritek media I can find and with one or two exceptions (probably due to being burned with grade B media etc) I have never had trouble with any of it. And Ritek media is compatible with a range of CD burners which TY isn't. Aopen writers for a start HATE TY.

I also have to say that their results haven't been realised in any case in some examples. They give TDK type 0 (USA! USA! pffft.....) media a higher rating than Verbatim Metal Azo. Well, I have found this to be a load of cr*p. The hallowed dark blue TDK media often develops errors toward the end of the disc after a few years. They don't react well to sunlight or damp conditions and their C1 error count was high in the first place. The Mitsubishi media fares much better (although the printable top surface is garbage.....)


TY media has always been known for its excellent quality. So, provided that TY media is on the recommended list for your CD-RW drive, TY media is an *excellent* choice. Also, TY discs are available at retail stores. Maxell CD-R *Pro* and all FujiFilm discs are TY and available at retail stores. Go to the URL:

http://www.hardwareguys.com/picks/cdrw.html

There are many other places on the 'net that praise TY media. Furthermore, there is no correlation between dye type and quality--not that you inferred that dye type is an important factor in choosing quality discs. Many people say there is, but there isn't!
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