PX-712A Disappointing results

[gbohn]

Hi;

I just got a Plextor PX-712A 12X/8X drive, and was disappointed that I can't seem to get burns as good as I see in the results of the online reviews. I'm trying to determine if this is a marginal (or hardware level 'updated' since review) drive problem, firmware problem, or a media problem

I used Plextools 2.14 to do a 5-12X CAV read after burn, and almost all burns seem to be unable to be read at full speed by the end of the disk.

I burned several Verbatim DVD+R (with Nero 6.3.1.7) at 8X (Powerec box checked), and they read back from 0 to about 4 or 4.2 GB o.k., but then slow down to 8X or even 2X to the end at 4.38GB. So far, they all read o.k., just more slowly at the end.

3-8X CAV playback also slows down to 2X at the end on the disks that slowed down that much at 5-12X.

I have a spindle of 50 Verbatim DataLife+ 8x DVD-R (Ink Jet Printable MCC 02RG20), some Jewel Case Verbatim DataLife+ 8X DVD-R (also MCC 02RG20), and some Jewel case Verbatim DataLife+ 8X DVD+R (MCC 003).

I've used Plextools 2.14 on some of the disks, and I can see that the PIE/PIF SUM8 and SUM1 errors may start out o.k., but trend sharply up toward the 4GB 'end' of the disk.

The DVD-R results (for a few spindle and Jewel Case) seem similar to the DVD+R as far as read speed goes, but some seem to have higher PIE/PIF to start.

I burned my one and only Plextor DVD+R capable of 12X burn, and this seemed to work better than the 8X's. It reads back at 5-12X fine (PIE Avg. 1.65, Max 82, Total 236,639).

I burned one of the Verbatim DVD+R at 6X, and that also seemed to work better (read o.k. 5-12X, low PIE/PIF).

So, are these results normal, or does anyone else with a PX-712A and 1.03 firmware get good results (a non-interupted playback from 5-12X CAV)?

Since the reviews I've read seem to get better results (using the same type of MCC 02RG20 and MCC 003 media) and I thought it seemed unlikely that I have three 'bad' batches of media, I was wondering what's going on.

This is on a PX-712A with TLA 0102 hardware, and 1.03 firmware.

I have access to a Pioneer DVR-A07 8X drive, and so far all the media that slow down on the PX-712A (at the end) seem to play 3-8X CAV smoothly on the Pioneer (I used Plextool 2.14 here as well).

The same batch of media burned and played back in the Pioneer play back 3-8X CAV smoothly as well.

So, at this point I don't know what to think.

Thanks;

[pchilson]

Rather than going through all the stuff. Just go and read this thread and see if it relates to your problems.
The "issues" start at about post # 21 in that thread.

[gbohn]

Rather than going through all the stuff. Just go and read this thread and see if it relates to your problems.
The "issues" start at about post # 21 in that thread.

After waiding through 6 pages of discussion, I think the gist is that some with similar/worse problems seem to be much happier with a replacement drive.

I'll probably get my drive RMA'd to see if that helps.

Thanks again;

[bob11879]

Since the Plextor supplied disc (Taiyo Yuden) worked as advertised, it probably is media related. Word has it that the MCC/Verbatim media had some formulation problems and wouldn't write at 8x well, let alone 12x. The new formulation has a "12x compatible" banner on the disc shrinkwrap.

[gbohn]

Since the Plextor supplied disc (Taiyo Yuden) worked as advertised, it probably is media related. Word has it that the MCC/Verbatim media had some formulation problems and wouldn't write at 8x well, let alone 12x. The new formulation has a "12x compatible" banner on the disc shrinkwrap.

I was actually only trying to burn at 8X for both DVD-R(I don't think this is supported at 12X) and DVD+R. For whatever reason, the same batches of media seem to work better in the Pioneer (also burned at 8X), or on the Plextor at 6X.

I also had a Sony 4X (RICHOHJPN W11) DVD RW media that got toasted on the PX-712 (can't write to it anymore), but I assumed this was the media.

I called Plextor last Friday, and the guy I spoke said he hadn't heard of any problems similar to mine. He said they would call me back, but so far haven't.

I guess I'll see what happens when I get a replacement drive (from the retailer I bought it from).

I also ordered some Taiyo Yuden 8X DVD-R to try.

With my luck, I'll probably get everything straightened out just as the Pioneer 16X becomes widely available...

[pchilson]

I called Plextor last Friday, and the guy I spoke said he hadn't heard of any problems similar to mine. He said they would call me back, but so far haven't.

He hadn't heard of it before? He must have just started and you were his first call...

[shimman]

aha.....my 712a is not doing very well.........i guess plextor has seems to rush too much that they produced many problematic drives....far more than few

[WNTR]

I quess you're right about that. I read a lot about very disapointing quality from the Plextor 712A on different forums. Serveral friends of mine have already twice RMA the drive. One even four times and his fifth drive bruns the same crap as the first four. I was planning on bying this drive but now I've bought the BenQ DW1600A. And yes my friends have tried several brands of dvd-media and on all media very high numbers of PI/PO-errors. I think Plextor better can get rid of the Mediatek chipset and use Philips Nexperia chipset.

[shimman]

plextor is using shitty sanyo chipset....known to have bugs in burning music cds

[alexnoe]

2 things:
1) It's not an LG drive (SCNR)
2) according to the C'T tests, the Plextor 712 does not like Mitsubishi 8x media at all, neither + nor -. Try different brands, like Taiyo Yuden

plextor is using shitty sanyo chipset....known to have bugs in burning music cds

Strange. Such 'bugs' can hardly exist to an extent that they affect RAW writing

[wicked1]

I had to RMA my plex 708A a couple times too. Before someone chimes in about bad media I dont call Verbatim bad media. All of my drives burn them great.

[Kennyshin]

I had to RMA my plex 708A a couple times too. Before someone chimes in about bad media I dont call Verbatim bad media. All of my drives burn them great.

Do you use all of your optical drives in external 1394 setup? What happens if you run all the drives at once? I can use up to five IDE devices for external 1394a connection.

[Halc]

plextor is using shitty sanyo chipset....known to have bugs in burning music cds ;)

Can you enlighten the rest of us to the source of this information?

Or was it just a joke and I'm too old to notice it? :)

[shimman]

there has been an issue with certain music cds that cannot be burnt correctly or without c2 errors with all drives using sanyo chipset

this is japanese website explaining about the bug
http://homepage2.nifty.com/yss/newcds/newcds.htm

cannot understand ??? use altavista.com's babel fish service...very rough translation but i don't have time to translate for you ...maybe someone else can

or you can try to burn this file fur yourselves to see how your burner do it
http://homepage2.nifty.com/yss/newcds/C2.zip

post the results with burners' names this bug has not been fixed or it has intentional to as a copy protection mechanism

712a is disappointing but not as much as 708a...708a was simply a pain in my #$%

[gbohn]

I guess I'll see what happens when I get a replacement drive (from the retailer I bought it from).

I also ordered some Taiyo Yuden 8X DVD-R to try.

My RMA replacement drive finally arrived. As I previously mentioned, I had three batches of Verbatim 8X media that all produced 'marginal' results on my first Plextor PX-712A burning at 8X. The 12X capable DVD+R media that came with the drive seemed to burn/read o.k.

I've only burned three disks so far on the new burner, but so far results are substantially better! I used Plextools 2.14 to measure PIE/PIF.

The new Taiyo Yuden TYG02 DVD-R media SUM8 results are PIE Avg 0.54, Max 17, Total 77,902. The SUM1 results were PIF Avg. 0.00, Max 3, Total 597.

This new burn read 5-12X CAV without interruption, but since I didn't have any of these media with the old burner, I don't know how they would have worked with it.

I also tried a sample of Jewel Case Verbatim DataLife+ (MCC 003 00) DVD+R from the same batch I used last time. It produced SUM 8 results of PIE Avg. 0.08, Max 14, Total 12,016. The SUM1 results were PIF Avg. 0.01, Max 7, Total 882. Unlike on the last drive, this new burn reads 5-12X CAV without interruption.

I also burned a sample of the Verbatim DataLife+ (MCC 02RG20) DVD-R from the same spindle of Inkjet Printable media I had tried before. This was noticably worse than the other two new burns, but still good enough to read uninterupted 5-12X CAV.

It gets lots of SUM8 PIE errors from about 3.75 GB to the end, but looks good up to that point. (PIE Max is mostly in the 40's, then jumps to about the 200's at about 3.75G, then jumps up to the 900's at about 4.1GB).

The SUM8 PIE results are: Avg. 10.72, Max 948, Total 1,538,151. The SUM1 PIF results are Avg. 0.38, Max 28, Total 53,978. This is still much better than the last drive was with this batch of media.

The profile for this media is much the same as before (on the old PX-712A), only lower in magnitude.

The new burner was similar to the last, TLA #0102, manufactured June, 2004. It also came with firmware 1.02 which I immediatly updated to 1.03.

So far, it looks like the replacement drive is working much better!

[gbohn]

So far, it looks like the replacement drive is working much better!

I've done a few more burns, and it looks like the new drive still doesn't do a great job with either batch of my MCC 02RG20 Verbatim DataLife+ 8X DVD-R media.

Interestingly, (at least so far) it looks like my Pioneer DVR-A07 does a much better job with the same batch of media.

The following image shows the Plextool 2.14 SUM8 results from two Jewel Case Verbatim DVD-R burned at 8X. The one on the left is from my DVR-A07. The right side shows another media from the same batch burned on my current PX-712A at 8X.



Another media from the same batch burned at 6X on the Plextor:



This is much better, but still not as good as the Pioneer burn.

I did two 8X burns from my new Spindle of Taiyo Yuden 8X DVD-R media, and the results are much closer, although the Pioneer still has better statistics:



Both the Taiyo Yuden and Verbatim are listed as some of the 4 types of 8X DVD-R media 'recommended' for the PX-712A. I haven't been able to find the other two (Maxell and TDK 8X DVD-R) to try.

My one burn of Jewel Cased Verbatim DataLife+ DVD+R (MCC 003) did produce excellent results (PIE Avg. 0.08, Max 14, Total 12,016).

So, I don't know what this means, other than the Plextor really doesn't seem to like my MCC 02RG20 media... Which I have a bunch of.

Oh well, at least I can make sure to burn it on the Pioneer, and wait to see if a future Plextor firmware update helps out.

[shimman]

omg!!!! the new drive unit is so much better than old one. anyone having had result, i recommend getting a replacement.

old one had tla# 0000 april 2004 japan made; new one has tla# of 0000 april 2004 china made

good testing media seems like tdk +/- 4x r

[gbohn]

For what it's worth, I've seen a thread that says the PX-712A has a problem with unit-unit variability, and that Plextor is hoping to solve this with a firmware change (if they can pull it off).

See http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?t=99294&page=10&pp=25