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BenQ DW1640 Pre-Review Test Data

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BenQ DW1640 Pre-Review Test Data

Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:50 pm

Hi Everyone,

Since it'll be another 1 or 2 weeks before I'll be able to finish the whole BenQ DW1640 review, I've decided to release the raw test data as a PDF. This test data is available here:
Clicky

It's a little cumbersome I know, but hopefully this PDF will help people in in their buying decisions, now that the drive is actually available here in North America.

Any questions are of course welcome! I'll do my best to answer them :)

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Re: BenQ DW1640 Pre-Review Test Data

Postby RJW on Tue Jul 19, 2005 4:20 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:Hi Everyone,

Since it'll be another 1 or 2 weeks before I'll be able to finish the whole BenQ DW1640 review, I've decided to release the raw test data as a PDF. This test data is available here:
Clicky

It's a little cumbersome I know, but hopefully this PDF will help people in in their buying decisions, now that the drive is actually available here in North America.

So Benq didn't want to waite any longer and put some presure on you guys to get some information out so they could actually release it. (they were tired of waiteing on the whole thing. ) ?

:lol:

My printer is busy printing the thingie because I allready saw that reading from my very bad monitor would be overkill.
It's the monitor that's bad.
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Postby RJW on Tue Jul 19, 2005 4:24 pm

What does inc. mean ?? (incomplete ???)

Hmm does the drive still not burn Verbatim DVD+RW 8x ? and yes was cdrinfo once again creative or is Benq now also limiting firmware versions between OEM/ Retail drives.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 5:02 pm

RJW wrote:What does inc. mean ?? (incomplete ???)

Hmm does the drive still not burn Verbatim DVD+RW 8x ? and yes was cdrinfo once again creative or is Benq now also limiting firmware versions between OEM/ Retail drives.


Inc. means the test did not complete, '---' means the test did not start.

As for the Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs... BenQ says they work, CDRInfo says they work (and have produced screenshots of it working) and yet my discs do not work at 8x. I've got to explore this issue further, but I've already ruled out multiple firmware versions, and my Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs have the exact same MID code and revision as the ones used by CDRinfo.com.... so I'm a little confused as to why they still come up as only being supported up to 4x :o

Edit: Good luck printing that thing out... it's kind of massive!
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Postby RJW on Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:17 pm

Hmm could you send me the full ADIP data output of DVD-identifier(or DVDinfopro ) of the Benq and another drive ?
I might have a faint idea.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 6:19 pm

RJW wrote:Hmm could you send me the full ADIP data output of DVD-identifier(or DVDinfopro ) of the Benq and another drive ?
I might have a faint idea.


Sure, but it'll have to be tonight, as I'm still at work right now.
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Postby Ian on Tue Jul 19, 2005 7:09 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:As for the Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs... BenQ says they work, CDRInfo says they work (and have produced screenshots of it working) and yet my discs do not work at 8x.


How are you testing this? In CD Speed? What does it say in DVDINFOpro?

What about Ridata's 8x +RW media?
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 7:40 pm

Ian wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:As for the Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs... BenQ says they work, CDRInfo says they work (and have produced screenshots of it working) and yet my discs do not work at 8x.


How are you testing this? In CD Speed? What does it say in DVDINFOpro?

What about Ridata's 8x +RW media?


If you want to overnight me some Ritek 8x DVD+RWs I'll be happy to try them out :wink:

I tried the Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs in DVDInfoPro and CD/DVD Speed, but I don't have screen shots with me at work (some people have to seperate their work life from their home life... I have to seperate my home life from my work life! :lol: ) so I'll post them when I get home later tonight.
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Postby Ian on Tue Jul 19, 2005 9:22 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:If you want to overnight me some Ritek 8x DVD+RWs I'll be happy to try them out :wink:


I will, but probably not overnight. I still need to send you that DL media too.

I wonder if the problems with the Verbatim media is due to the revision.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 10:33 pm

Ian wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:If you want to overnight me some Ritek 8x DVD+RWs I'll be happy to try them out :wink:


I will, but probably not overnight. I still need to send you that DL media too.

I wonder if the problems with the Verbatim media is due to the revision.


I need some 6x DVD-RWs from Ritek too :wink:
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jul 19, 2005 10:39 pm

Here's the pics of Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs as seen by the DW1640 in Nero CD/DVD Speed and DVDInfoPro. I've also included a pic of the same Verbatim 8x DVD+RW as seen by the LG 4163B in DVDInfoPro.

Any ideas?
Attachments
BenQDW1640_Verb8xDVD+RW_DVDSpeed.jpg
BenQDW1640_Verb8xDVD+RW_DVDSpeed.jpg (57.48 KiB) Viewed 4148 times
Verb8xDVD+RW_DW1640_DVDInfoPro.png
Verb8xDVD+RW_DW1640_DVDInfoPro.png (82.74 KiB) Viewed 4174 times
Verb8xDVD+RW_LG4163B_DVDInfoPro.png
Verb8xDVD+RW_LG4163B_DVDInfoPro.png (82.82 KiB) Viewed 4176 times
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Postby Ian on Tue Jul 19, 2005 11:06 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:I need some 6x DVD-RWs from Ritek too :wink:


Word. I'm on it.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:06 am

Ian wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:I need some 6x DVD-RWs from Ritek too :wink:


Word. I'm on it.


I also need a new car.... :D
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Postby Ian on Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:27 am

dolphinius_rex wrote:I also need a new car.... :D


Well.. I've geen playing a lot of GTA lately. :wink:
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:30 am

Ian wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:I also need a new car.... :D


Well.. I've geen playing a lot of GTA lately. :wink:


Sweet! Just make sure you give it a paint job before you send it my way.... I don't need any extra stars if you know what I mean :wink:
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Postby RJW on Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:45 am

Hmm it seems to be a bit more dificult.
Also why is DVD info pro only showeing byte 0-63 Iin this case you need the ones higher.
I know DVD-identifier does this, That's why I recommended it in the first place and I thought DVD info could also do this however with these shots I have some doubts.
Last edited by RJW on Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Burn2death on Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:46 am

I'm really looking forward to your review Rex, and I'm getting tire of waiting for ti to hit the stores, when ever that will be?
do you have any ideas Rex?
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Postby Burn2death on Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:51 am

and I like your avatar Ian (White bread)!
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Postby ala42 on Wed Jul 20, 2005 10:09 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:Here's the pics of Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs as seen by the DW1640 in Nero CD/DVD Speed and DVDInfoPro. I've also included a pic of the same Verbatim 8x DVD+RW as seen by the LG 4163B in DVDInfoPro.

Any ideas?
My guess the $92 value at byte 4 in the dump causes the problem. In a real ADIP like displayed by DVD Identifier it is located at address 0. In ECMA-337, defining +RW at 2,4x and 4x, this byte is defined as Disk Category and Version Number for this document, see page 33. $92 is the identifier for 2.4x or 4x RW disks.
A RICOHJPNW21 8x +RW disk has $93 at this address. I could not find a document on the ecma site specifying 8x +RW media, but have no doubt that 8x media needs a different version number. See Ecma-349 to see how 8x +R media is handled.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:02 pm

ala42 wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:Here's the pics of Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs as seen by the DW1640 in Nero CD/DVD Speed and DVDInfoPro. I've also included a pic of the same Verbatim 8x DVD+RW as seen by the LG 4163B in DVDInfoPro.

Any ideas?
My guess the $92 value at byte 4 in the dump causes the problem. In a real ADIP like displayed by DVD Identifier it is located at address 0. In ECMA-337, defining +RW at 2,4x and 4x, this byte is defined as Disk Category and Version Number for this document, see page 33. $92 is the identifier for 2.4x or 4x RW disks.
A RICOHJPNW21 8x +RW disk has $93 at this address. I could not find a document on the ecma site specifying 8x +RW media, but have no doubt that 8x media needs a different version number. See Ecma-349 to see how 8x +R media is handled.


That seems quite likely the case. Perhaps this is why Verbatim decided to NOT release their 8x DVD+RWs.... since they have this kind of fatal flaw of sorts.
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Postby RJW on Thu Jul 21, 2005 3:54 am

ala42 wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:Here's the pics of Verbatim 8x DVD+RWs as seen by the DW1640 in Nero CD/DVD Speed and DVDInfoPro. I've also included a pic of the same Verbatim 8x DVD+RW as seen by the LG 4163B in DVDInfoPro.

Any ideas?


My guess the $92 value at byte 4 in the dump causes the problem. In a real ADIP like displayed by DVD Identifier it is located at address 0. In ECMA-337, defining +RW at 2,4x and 4x, this byte is defined as Disk Category and Version Number for this document, see page 33. $92 is the identifier for 2.4x or 4x RW disks.

I think you make a small mistake here but hey I can be wrong.

Page 33 of ECMA 337 is talking about the bits in the byte (1byte->8 bits if I'm right) So bit 7 to 4 of byte 0 specifies the disc category not byte 4 . WE can not see this with any of the current tools. DVD identifier shows the bytes (At least that's my interpretation but I will ask Kriss to be sure )
So $92 is byte 4 like you said which belongs to Data zone allocation. It should be the starting point.(According to the ECMA is should be set to 00)
Now about the complete dump. Dolphinius Rex mailed me the complete dumps of what DVD Identifier returns what is shows (Maybe put them up) is that his Verbatim 8x DVD+RW disc's miss the complext Extended block 1 (bytes 97 to 127) which seems to descripe the writing strategies for beyond 4x and up to 8x.
RICOH disc's do have this block.
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Postby ala42 on Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:15 pm

RJW wrote:I think you make a small mistake here but hey I can be wrong.
DVD Infopro is wrong, it shows four extra bytes at the begin of the hexdump. DVD Identifier does not display this bytes.
Page 33 of ECMA 337 is talking about the bits in the byte (1byte->8 bits if I'm right) So bit 7 to 4 of byte 0 specifies the disc category not byte 4 . WE can not see this with any of the current tools. DVD identifier shows the bytes (At least that's my interpretation but I will ask Kriss to be sure )

To get the mapping, have a look at the MID. The Disk Manufacturer name is located at bytes 19-26 (decimal) -> $13-$1A hex, the media type at 27-29 ->$1B-$1D according to ECMA-337. Just delete the first four bytes DVD Infopro displays and everything is as it should be.
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Postby rahzel on Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:59 pm

if anyone doesnt know, firmware BSJB was just released.

Release Reason:

1. Improve the writing performance for low speed & DVD+R DL media.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Fri Jul 22, 2005 1:32 am

rahzel wrote:if anyone doesnt know, firmware BSJB was just released.

Release Reason:

1. Improve the writing performance for low speed & DVD+R DL media.


Yay! I get to re-burn and re-test all the DVD+RDLs.... again!

Man, this really reminds me of the DW1620 :lol:
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Postby RJW on Fri Jul 22, 2005 5:00 am

ala42 wrote:
RJW wrote:I think you make a small mistake here but hey I can be wrong.
DVD Infopro is wrong, it shows four extra bytes at the begin of the hexdump. DVD Identifier does not display this bytes.

Your right about this one. Hmm overlooked it. I normally only use DVD identifier. Sorry my fault. Good that you pointed out.

So the Mitubishi media has 2 errors.
For completeness I will post both blocks reported by DVD identifier on Benq 1640 as Dolphinius Rex e-mailed me.

RICOHJPNW21 real 8x DVD+RW
** INFO : Hex Dump Of 'Media Code'-Block Listed Below
** INFO : 4-Byte Header Preceding 'Media Code'-Block Discarded
** INFO : Format 11h (Method 1) - ADIP Information
0000 : 93 0f 04 00 00 03 00 00 00 26 05 3f 00 00 00 00 .........&.?....
0010 : 00 00 03 52 49 43 4f 48 4a 50 4e 57 32 31 01 20 ...RICOHJPNW21.
0020 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0030 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0040 : 02 00 01 2e 70 54 00 7e 7d 4e 03 1e 00 7c 91 2e ....pT.~}N...|..
0050 : 02 1c 00 80 84 26 02 1e 00 00 04 0a 09 00 00 00 .....&..........
0060 : 82 00 04 04 00 00 00 ff 01 ed ec eb 10 0f 02 01 ................
0070 : 02 01 02 03 02 04 10 0b 02 01 02 01 00 05 05 08 ................
0080 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0090 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00a0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00b0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00c0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00d0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00e0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00f0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........

MCC supposed f 8x DVD+RW

* INFO : Hex Dump Of 'Media Code'-Block Listed Below
** INFO : 4-Byte Header Preceding 'Media Code'-Block Discarded
** INFO : Format 11h (Method 1) - ADIP Information
0000 : 92 0f 04 00 00 03 00 00 00 26 05 3f 00 00 00 00 .........&.?....
0010 : 00 00 01 4d 4b 4d 00 00 00 00 00 41 30 33 00 39 ...MKM.....A03.9
0020 : 23 00 94 79 64 02 20 00 9c 7a 6c 02 20 00 9a 7b #..yd. ..zl. ..{
0030 : 68 02 20 12 12 10 e0 00 f0 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h. .............
0040 : 01 00 17 38 00 29 8b 3e 02 24 00 2d 8e 38 02 24 ...8.).>.$.-.8.$
0050 : 00 2c 90 3e 02 24 44 35 30 e0 f0 30 40 00 00 00 .,.>.$D50..0@...
0060 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0070 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0080 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
0090 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00a0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00b0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00c0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00d0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00e0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ................
00f0 : 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........

As we see here extended block 1 (The bytes I said befor are missing data with the MCC disc's. That's in the line with 0060 and 0070. This line should decscribe information for burning higher as 4x up to 8x officially. (That's a official answer !)
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