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In House Review - LG GSA-4167B 16x Super-Multi DVD±RW/RAM

DVD-R/W, DVD+R/RW, DVD-RAM

Postby dodecahedron on Sun Jan 01, 2006 7:32 pm

a couple of questions:

1. in the specs of the drive, DVD+RW speeds listed are 2.4x , 4x (CLV) , 8x (ZCLV).
no 6x! is this an omission (on LG's website/manual/whatever)?
if it does do 6x, is it CLV or ZCLV? (see next note as well).

2. in the sepcs of the drive, DVD-RW 6x is listed as ZCLV. note that for the GSA-4163B it is listed as CLV, and also the pic in the review's performance section shows it to be CLV! here's the pic:
Image

3. a bit off topic, but what's the differences (spec-wise, performance-wise) between the 4166 and 4167 ? is the 4166 out already ?
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Postby Scour on Sun Jan 01, 2006 7:53 pm

dodecahedron wrote:
3. a bit off topic, but what's the differences (spec-wise, performance-wise) between the 4166 and 4167 ? is the 4166 out already ?


In Germany both drives are out, the 4166 is newer

The 4166 does 16x CAV, the 4167 P-CAV (a bit faster)

The 4166 have Lightscribe and uses Matsushita-cipset, the 4167 have no LS and Renesas-chipsets.
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Postby Ian on Sun Jan 01, 2006 7:56 pm

1. If I remember right, it doesn't let you choose 6x when 8x media is used.

2. Yeah, you're right. It is CLV. I can't remember if that was in the manual like that or if it was a mistake I made.

3. The 4166 is out in some places (I have one at least). The biggest differences is that the 4166 uses CAV when writing to DVD+R and DVD-R at 16x and it supports 8x DVD+R DL out of the box. There are a few other minor differences as well.
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Postby dodecahedron on Sun Jan 01, 2006 8:11 pm

Ian wrote:1. If I remember right, it doesn't let you choose 6x when 8x media is used.

3. The 4166 is out in some places (I have one at least). The biggest differences is that the 4166 uses CAV when writing to DVD+R and DVD-R at 16x and it supports 8x DVD+R DL out of the box. There are a few other minor differences as well.

1. but does it let you burn at 6x when using the 2.4x Verbatim DVD+R DL ? or other DVD+R DL media ?

3. OK so a bit slower for 16x DVD+/-R and LightScribe. the 8x DVD+R DL "out of the box" isn't really that important since the 4167 can be upgraded to it.
just checked LG's website, absolutely no difference there between the 4167 and 4166 except for LightScribe and DVD+R DL 8x (of course they don't say anything about PCAV/CAV etc.)
i wonder why they 'downgraded' the 16x PCAV of the 4167 to the 16x CAV of the 4166. the 4166 is the newer model, no ?

is a review in the works (or planned at least)?
is the 2166 supposed to be identical to the 4166, just external (can we infer from it's review what the 4166 is like?)

more questions about the 4167/63/maybe also 66:
4. why DVD+R 8x ZCLV and not PCAV ? (has this been discussed before? i can't remember)
5. why no DVD-R 12x ? is this just an omission in the specs or does the drive really not do that ?
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Postby Ian on Sun Jan 01, 2006 10:27 pm

1. but does it let you burn at 6x when using the 2.4x Verbatim DVD+R DL ? or other DVD+R DL media ?

>> Yes, by default 6x is the drive's maximum DVD+R DL writing speed. I couldn't get it to write at 8x. Hopefully in the next firmware?

i wonder why they 'downgraded' the 16x PCAV of the 4167 to the 16x CAV of the 4166. the 4166 is the newer model, no ?

>> Yeah, its a slightly newer design. I'm not sure why they did what they did though.

is a review in the works (or planned at least)?

>> If LG can fix the problems we saw with the 2166. If not, I'm not going to waste my time.

is the 2166 supposed to be identical to the 4166, just external (can we infer from it's review what the 4166 is like?)

>> The 2166 has a 4164/4166 in the external case. Aside from the ID string I'm not sure if there are differences in the firmware.

4. why DVD+R 8x ZCLV and not PCAV ? (has this been discussed before? i can't remember)

>> No idea.

5. why no DVD-R 12x ? is this just an omission in the specs or does the drive really not do that ?

>> It really doesn't write at 12x. Kinda dumb IMO.
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Postby Gabe on Sun Jan 01, 2006 11:16 pm

Ian wrote:i wonder why they 'downgraded' the 16x PCAV of the 4167 to the 16x CAV of the 4166. the 4166 is the newer model, no ?



I guess it depneds on the other chipset of the 4166
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Postby Scour on Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:24 pm

Hello!

Is it true, that the 4167 still make 12x-burns only on +R, but not -R?

The 2166 sould do 12x, but in the review no one is burned at 12x.
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Postby ItalianJob on Thu Jan 26, 2006 7:48 pm

The 4167 DL13 is available on http://au.lgservice.com :

Model:GSA-4167B

Ver:DL13

Improvement Point
- addtion of DVD R media codes
--> DVD+R: SONY 16x, Prodisc(R04) 16x, Optodic 8x, AML 4x
--> DVD-R: SONY 16x, TDK 8x, MBI 16x, Prodisc 16x, Must 8x, DVSN 4x
--> DVD-RW: OPTODISC 6x, PRINCO 4x,
- Improvement of DVD DL writing quality
- Improvement of CD-R Audio playability at some CD players
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Postby Ian on Thu Jan 26, 2006 10:07 pm

Thanks for the heads up ItalianJob!
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Postby karangguni on Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:27 pm

Alright, I actually signed up just to add my two cent's worth here. Hopefully this informaton is useful and doesn't invite a storm of controversey.

dodecahedron wrote:just checked LG's website, absolutely no difference there between the 4167 and 4166 except for LightScribe and DVD+R DL 8x (of course they don't say anything about PCAV/CAV etc.)
i wonder why they 'downgraded' the 16x PCAV of the 4167 to the 16x CAV of the 4166. the 4166 is the newer model, no ?


This isn't a case of a downgrade or upgrade. The two drives use entirely different chipsets. The 4166B uses a Panasonic chipset; the 4167B (and 4163B) use a Renesas chipset. The use of P-CAV seems to be a property of the Renesas chipset. My guess is that the Panasonic chipset used in the 4166B does not support P-CAV. Panasonic chipsets have been used in a few OEM GWA model writers and AFAIK, those all use CAV for 16x writing as well, not P-CAV.

dodecahedron wrote:more questions about the 4167/63/maybe also 66:
4. why DVD+R 8x ZCLV and not PCAV ? (has this been discussed before? i can't remember)


I can't comment on the 4166B but this seems to be something that LG believes in. At the time the 4163B came out, it was the first drive that supported three different types of write strategies for DVD media : CLV, Z-CLV and P-CAV. My guess is it was something the engineers in LG dreamed up. The 4167B seems to have followed this trend. Burn times with Z-CLV at 8x are not shabby anyway.

In the same token, you can ask why other writers use CAV for 16x writes, when P-CAV obviously does 16x writes faster.

Btw, both the 4163B/4167B use Z-CLV for 8x DVD-R and 8x DVD+RW burns as well. I know the 4166B uses it for burning 8x media but which ones, I am not sure. Note that 4163B/4167B does Z-CLV at 6x->8x whereas the 4166B does it at 4x->8x. This is also probably something inherent in the chipsets used.

dodecahedron wrote:5. why no DVD-R 12x ? is this just an omission in the specs or does the drive really not do that ?


Actually, the 4167B does indeed support 12x burns for DVD-R but it is not selectable. If you burn a DVD-R at 16x and the writer finds that it cannot reach 16x, it falls back to 12x. Same behaviour with the 4163B. I know this for a fact because my 4163B is in a computer that for some reason does not allow it to burn at 16x. As a result, it always burns 16x DVD-R discs at 12x. Why LG does not make 12x selectable is something which has been irritating 4163B/4167B owners for some time, seeing as that often produces the best burn quality with quite a few makes of 16x DVD-R discs.

Btw, the 4166B does do 12x burns for 16x DVD-R media (and 12x is selectable). Another idiotic chipset property again?
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Postby Scour on Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:59 pm

karangguni wrote:Btw, the 4166B does do 12x burns for 16x DVD-R media (and 12x is selectable). Another idiotic chipset property again?


I think it´s just the FW.
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