Tolyngee wrote:Cfitz, not trying to be argumentative here, please don't take it as such
Not to worry - I didn't take it as such
Tolyngee wrote:So, to be clearer with my original comment, you really can't accurately go by #3 with the F1 ... which only has the max burn speed option of 16x, then it is just 44x with it deciding how to burn it...
I think it is fair to post results for the F1. First, remember that TheWizard has provided space for firmware version, so we can easily accommodate different results from the same drive model using different firmware. Second, the results included in this thread are for the combination of drive and media, not just for the media alone. Thus, you need not worry about giving a particular brand of media a bad name just because it does poorly in one drive. Third, and most importantly, it is perfectly acceptable, and in fact desirable, to post actual achievable results here and not worry about what might have been had another firmware been available.
If I understand what you are saying correctly, you are concerned about the lack of manually selectable speeds between 16x and the drive-selected max speed. I believe you might feel it is unfair to report that the F1 is only capable of burning a particular disc at 16x without errors when you feel it could go as high as 20x, 24x, 32x or even 40x without errors, if only the firmware allowed you to choose manual speeds greater than 16x. I, on the other hand, think this is perfectly fair. If the F1 can't burn a particular disc without errors at the F1's chosen max speed and you are forced to drop all the way down to the highest manually selectable speed of 16x to get an error-free burn, then simply report the result as 16x. In such a case, 16x is
the maximum speed at which the F1 can burn that disc without errors. Maybe the drive hardware could do better, but if the firmware won't allow you to utilize that hardware, then it doesn't matter.
In summary, here is how I would suggest testing and reporting the F1:
1. Burn a disc at the maximum speed as automatically selected by the F1 (keeping track of the actual burn time so that you can correctly ascertain the real burn speed used).
2. If that disc is error-free*, report the actual burn speed as the final result.
3. If the first disc is not error-free, switch to the highest manually selectable speed, and burn a disc at that speed. If you are using the original firmware, that highest manual speed will have to be 16x. If you have the newer firmware, you can start backing down at 32x.
4. If the second disc is error-free, report that burn speed (in your case 16x) as the final result.
5. If the second disc also has errors, repeat steps 3-5 with the next lower speed setting.
6. Continue until you get either an error-free disc or discover that an error-free disc is not possible at any speed, and then report appropriately.
7. When you do report results, be sure to include your firmware version, just as TheWizard originally requested.
* Since the F1 does not report C2 errors, you will have to test the burn quality in a different drive that does correctly report C2 errors.
Maybe there are a lot of brands of discs out there that don't burn error-free at the speed chosen by the F1 but would burn just fine at a slightly slower speed if such a speed could be manually selected. But it can't, so they will just have to be reported as 16x. If Yamaha finds that to be embarrassing, perhaps they will release yet another revision of firmware that will include better automatic speed selection, even more user selectable speeds, and that will allow user selectable speeds to be used in conjunction with their OWSC feature.
Tolyngee wrote:I can't help but wonder if that is why Yamaha put the added selectable burn speeds into the new firmwares: not [just] because of rants from owners, but because of 8x not being tuned as well as higher speeds, thus the user (in some ways) being forced to burn their cds with less quality than the burner is capable of...
Which goes right back to my point: it doesn't matter if the burner could do better as long as Yamaha doesn't allow it to do better. We can only report on what it can actually do as currently configured, not on what might be possible if Yamaha included more flexible firmware.