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Media Compatibility With CD-RW Drives - Which Media Is Best?

General discussion about recordable CD, DVD and BD media and write quality testing.

Postby TheWizard on Sat Dec 27, 2003 5:58 am

Magnificent! You da man! :)
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Postby casey on Sat Dec 27, 2003 7:29 am

Got 6 more disc's (brands) from 2 of my suppliers this morning, will post later.
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Postby MediumRare on Sat Dec 27, 2003 9:38 am

casey wrote:Got 6 more disc's (brands) from 2 of my suppliers this morning, will post later.

Nice. Could you post the ATIP's for the media you test too?

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Postby casey on Sat Dec 27, 2003 9:52 am

LG 8525b firm 1.01
Brand: Memorex (97m26s66f) - 52x - 80 min: Manuf. CMC - Burn @ 52x 100% ok
Brand: Princo (97m27s28f) - 56x - 80 min: Manuf. Princo - Burn @ 32x 100% ok
Brand: Intenso (97m19s06f) - 52x - 80 min: Manuf. Unknown - Burn @ 32x 100% ok
Brand: Dysan (97m32s19f) - 48x - 80 min: Manuf. Prodisc - Burn @ 52x 100% ok
Brand: Logik (97m24s39f) - 48x - 80 min: Manuf. Unitech - Burn @ 40x 100% ok
Brand: Creation (97m27s18f) - 48x - 80 min: Manuf. Plasmon - Burn @ 12x 100% ok

Creation, sh….. the worst I have ever seen !!!!
With Princo not far behind, 56x media !

Hope I have time next week, will try and test my LG 8523b…….
Have a good weekend.
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Postby casey on Sat Dec 27, 2003 10:10 am

ATIP’S OF PREVIOUS MEDIA TESTS:
LG 8525b firm 1.01
Brand: HP (97m24s01f) - 24x - 80 min: Manuf. TY -
Brand: Imation (97m26s66f) - 48x - 80 min: Manuf. CMC -
Brand: Acer Gold (97m22s67f) - 40x - 80 min: Manuf. Acer -
Brand: Maxell (97m25s29f) - 40x - 80min: Manuf. Hitachi/Maxell -
Brand: TDK (97m15s17f) - Multi Speed - 80min: Manuf. Ritek -
Brand: HP (97m24s01f) - 16x - 80 min: Manuf. TY -
Brand: Sony (97m24s11f)- 16x - 80 min: Manuf. Sony -
Brand: Sony (97m24s11f )- 24x - 80 min: Manuf. Sony -
Brand: Maxell (97m25s29f) - 48x - 80min: Manuf. Hitachi/Maxell
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PRIMEON/CSI 99 min "48x"

Postby MediumRare on Sun Jan 11, 2004 3:59 pm

Code: Select all
LiteOn LTR 48246S
Firmware SS0E...........PRIMEON/CSI 99 min "48x" ...............24X

ATIP from SmartBurn 3.1.6:
Code: Select all
        Drive Type = CD-RW   
         Disc Type = CDR
          Material = Phthalocyanine
           Lead In = 97:24:26
          Lead Out = 79:59:74
  Nominal Capacity = 702.83MB
Manufacturer Maybe = Computer Support Italcard s.r.l.
SMART-BURN Speed Limit = 48X (Write)

The discs are labeled as "48x", but the dealer sells them as 24x, hence rating in quotes.

The dealer is right- I burned 2 disks at 24x. KProbe showed C1 max/ave= 21/3.375, CDSpeed: all green. I tried 2 burns at 32x with no luck. The first one had unreadable sectors at 3 min, the rest was OK. I want to share the CDSpeed surface scan of the other try because I've never seen anything like this before :o :roll:
Image
CDSpeed seems to have been confused, though, because KProbe scanned most of the disc (with a start time of 2 min after the initial unreadable sectors).

These are the only 99 min media I've seen here. I picked them up for a TV recording (VCD), which just fit. However, their utility is rather limited- my DVD player skipped and hung occasionally. Seeing as they're twice the price of quality 80 min media, the only advantage is the convenience of not having to change discs during the show. Maybe it's time to pick up a DVD burner. :wink:

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Postby TheWizard on Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:08 am

Just ask dolphinius_rex, he'll tell you Computer Support Italcard sucks, especially since they took over the manufacturing of Mitsui discs. Oh well, at least you got the discs to burn fine at 24X. Thanks, MediumRare. :)
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Re: PRIMEON/CSI 99 min "48x"

Postby dodecahedron on Mon Jan 12, 2004 10:16 am

MediumRare wrote:Image

all that red hurts my eyes.
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One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
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Re: PRIMEON/CSI 99 min "48x"

Postby MediumRare on Mon Jan 12, 2004 3:16 pm

dodecahedron wrote:all that red hurts my eyes.

At least you know then that you're not colour blind. :D :wink:

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Re: PRIMEON/CSI 99 min "48x"

Postby dodecahedron on Mon Jan 12, 2004 4:50 pm

MediumRare wrote:
dodecahedron wrote:all that red hurts my eyes.

At least you know then that you're not colour blind. :D :wink:

G

i am actually a little bit color blind. :o
i wasn't joking when i mentioned it here. :wink:
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Postby Centrilium on Sat Jan 17, 2004 1:10 pm

Got to stress something though..lately the new batch of CMC cdr media has been very good.
I have bought Melody Arra 40X,EGen 48X,Imation Professional Grade gold cdrs and they all gave me A+ write startegy ratings.I used to believe that CMC medias are of low quality those days but the new batches/stocks which came out this year is really good.[/img]
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Postby TheWizard on Sun Jan 18, 2004 7:49 am

I've never had a problem with CMC either, whether it be old or new media. I recently purchased some old 16X Prime Peripherals discs, made by CMC, and these are probably the lowest quality I have encountered, but still not bad. They burn at the rated speed, which is expected, in one of my drives and I have to knock the burning speed down to 8X for them to burn successfully in another one of my drives. Had they not burned at all, then I would have said they were terrible, but knocking the burning speed down a notch isn't awful. All in all, the discs are not great, not poor, but OK. And OK discs are fine by me!
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Postby MediumRare on Sun Jan 18, 2004 6:16 pm

Centrilium wrote:and they all gave me A+ write startegy ratings.

Unfortunately there are (at least) 2 uses for these codes. cfitz looked into this a while ago. See the links in that post. One usage by one source is a quality grade. But this is determined by tests, and is not codeds on the disc- which manufacturer would knowingly label media as Grade C anyway?

The codes you referred to are encoded in the ATIP of some media (see them via some identifier tools, e.g. in Nero: Disc Info + "Shift-Ctrl-Refresh") and have a different meaning: Asymmetry range (beta range +/-) and media type (A,B,C) information is used during OPC (Optimum Power Calibration) to find the best laser settings for burning on the disc.

I don't think that you should use this value as a quality rating. True, older CMC's had A- and some newer ones are A+ like MC and TY. But RiTEK show A- and made-by-TDK media are B-. These are (in my experience) miles better than CMC.

Incidentally, my latest encounter with CMC (the Fujitsu-Siemens disks) is "useable but not great".

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Postby Centrilium on Mon Jan 19, 2004 4:58 am

For me the CMCs are better than the RiTeks.So far HP and Imation have gone with them and they can't go wrong right?But I do konw that after trying so many cdrs(TY,Hitachi Maxell,RiTEK,CMC,Plasmon,Prodisc,MCmedia) the my Lite ON seems to favour CMC besides the other established barnds like TY annd MCmedia.Prodisc cdrs were not bad as well.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:37 am

I don't trust HP any farther then I could throw their head office building... seriously. The only thing in my opinion that they done that is good, is work on that funky DVD burner / thermal printer that was mentioned on the front page a little while back!

The *ONLY* brand that I give a blanket green card too (i.e. trust without concern) is Maxell. They have proven themselves time and time again, and I am very impressed with their quality control... just not their prices.
Punch Cards -> Paper Tape -> Tape Drive -> 8" Floppy Diskette -> 5 1/4" Floppy Diskette -> 3 1/2" "Flippy" Diskette -> CD-R -> DVD±R -> BD-R

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More Media

Postby DeathStalker77 on Wed Jan 21, 2004 12:10 pm

I'll see if I can't post some images of the full readings, but I just picked up some AudioBahn CDRs from Circuit City - wasn't expecting much ($4.99 50pk after rebate) - and I refuse to even TRY their Jensen CDRs after getting a horrid batch last year. But these AudioBahn's have turned out to be fairly good - not great mind you (they're just CMC, but rated at A+) and the burns have been average at 52x - on par with the TDK (CMC) batches I've been getting from BestBuy lately. No where NEAR the quality of Fuji's 50pk TYs, but acceptable levels of C1 for everyday usage. I think the Ritek TDKs were a bit better than the CMCs, but I haven't run enough tests (yet) to say for certain. I just know that I'm still staying away from the Fuji Prodiscs - they are SO noticably thinner and more transluscent than ANY other CDRs I've ever gotten - even generic silvers. Unfortunately, the one company here in the States that was manufacturing very good quality 99min CDRs is apparently no longer making them, just the 90min. I'm still looking for another vendor but when you can get 200 CDRs for under $20, it doesn't make much sense to spend more than half again that just to have the whole thing on one disc.

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Postby dolphinius_rex on Wed Jan 21, 2004 2:17 pm

Verbatim Ultraspeed+ CD-RW media:

Drive Type = CD-RW
Disc Type = ULTRA SPEED CD-RW 32X
Material = Phase Change
Lead In = 97:34:25
Lead Out = 74:43:00
Nominal Capacity = 656.40MB
Manufacturer Maybe = Mitsubishi Chemicals Corporation
SMART-BURN Speed Limit = 32X (Write)

Burned in Plextor Premium at 32x (full 656MB image)

All green in Nero CD Speed, tested on the Plextor Premium drive. This disc was burned 5 times and it was all green every time.
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Postby TheWizard on Wed Jan 21, 2004 9:04 pm

Good stuff, dolphinius_rex, thanks. :)

Good stuff also, DeathStalker77, although I have to ask. Did you test a burned AudioBahn CD with the ScanDisc option in Nero CD Speed? If all the blocks are green for a CD burned at 52X, then I'll post the results. I'll also need to know which drive your burned the disc with. Thanks. :)
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Postby dodecahedron on Thu Jan 22, 2004 7:12 am

TheWizard wrote:I'll also need to know which drive your burned the disc with. Thanks. :)

and the firmware version.
One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them,
One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Thu Jan 22, 2004 11:44 am

dodecahedron wrote:
TheWizard wrote:I'll also need to know which drive your burned the disc with. Thanks. :)

and the firmware version.


Oops! Plextor Premium - Firmware 1.05
Punch Cards -> Paper Tape -> Tape Drive -> 8" Floppy Diskette -> 5 1/4" Floppy Diskette -> 3 1/2" "Flippy" Diskette -> CD-R -> DVD±R -> BD-R

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Drive Specs

Postby DeathStalker77 on Thu Jan 22, 2004 11:44 am

Wizard & dodecahedron:

The drive is an LTR52327S with QSOB. I haven't run the Scandisc yet, but I will (probably this weekend). I generally burn everything at 52x without a problem - overburns I do at 40x and regularly get an average of an extra 20mb on an overburn (with TDK and the AudioBahn - more with the TYs). These would all be VCD/SVCDs burned with Nero 5.5x - any BIN/CUEs I burn with CDMate (and those I regularly do on TYs as well). 8)

--- DeathStalker

BTW, if I don't have a personal website to link the images to, how do I post them here?
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Postby TheWizard on Fri Jan 23, 2004 2:25 am

Pictures aren't a requirement. If you post that Nero ScanDisc showed the disc as 100% green block, then I'll believe you. :)
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Fri Jan 23, 2004 3:27 am

it's a good thing too! 8)

even tiny pictures start to add up after a while! :o
Punch Cards -> Paper Tape -> Tape Drive -> 8" Floppy Diskette -> 5 1/4" Floppy Diskette -> 3 1/2" "Flippy" Diskette -> CD-R -> DVD±R -> BD-R

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FUJI TY/Prodisc Update

Postby DeathStalker77 on Fri Jan 23, 2004 4:23 pm

Ok, I finally got ahold of someone in authority at FujiFil - Mr. Frank Bulzomi, Sr Marketing Manager. I expressed to him my dissatisfaction at the switch from TY to Prodisc for the 100pk spindles (the 50pks I've found at Best Buy are still TY!). He explained that TY is actually shifting their focus to DVD manufacturing (good for DVD burners, bad for CDR burners). He explained that it was a competative decision to move to a Taiwanese manufacturer (they opted not to go with the generally lower quality Chinese manufacturers), as the majority of their brand name competitors (TDK, Maxell, Memorex, etc) are using Taiwanese.

Personally, I will still, at this point, avoid the Fuji Prodiscs - they are physically thinner than the CMC or Riteks that I have gotten, and noticably more translucent.

It would be appreciated if someone who has a batch of the 100pk Fuji Prodiscs could post some Nero and K-Probe stats on them. If not, I suppose I can afford to get at least one spindle of them when they go on sale next.

It's kind of sad that there seem to be no "industry leaders" at this point and that everything is dropping to the lowest common standards.

Anyone here have contacts at TY to get their position on things?

--- DeathStalker
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Verbatim DataLife Pastel 48x

Postby MediumRare on Fri Jan 23, 2004 6:30 pm

Code: Select all
LiteOn LTR 48246S
Firmware SS0E...........Verbatim DL Pastel/TY 80min 48X.........48X

ATIP from SmartBurn 3.1.6:
Code: Select all
        Drive Type = CD-RW   
         Disc Type = CDR
          Material = Cyanine
           Lead In = 97:24:01
          Lead Out = 79:59:72
  Nominal Capacity = 702.83MB
Manufacturer Maybe = Taiyo Yuden Company Limited
SMART-BURN Speed Limit = 48X (Write)

I've had the 32x Pastels and the 48x rated discs started to show up here, so I couldn't resist. I haven't encountered other TY's, and the price is OK (9 Euro/20 slimpack or 17/50 cake box- we don't get those ridiculous rebates here).

They're excellent- C1 max/mean 6/0.15, CD Speed all green (of course :D).

Dodecahedron, Harrier- keep an eye open for these, you may find them too. They're DataLife (not Plus) and Made in Japan.

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