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Weird Dual Layer Buring Observation

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Weird Dual Layer Buring Observation

Postby jberry on Sun Jan 15, 2006 10:46 pm

You know I thought I would do a Test of some home movies burning onto DVD+R DL booktyped to DVD-ROM on the Benq 1640. All on Verbatim DL, same firmware and everything.

2.4x burn=quality score of 44
4X burn=Quality score of 74
8x burn=Quality Score of 88

Now I am not going to wa$te any more media so this may be an unscientific question, but why does 8X speed burn better? I would have thought 2.4 would have given best results.
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Postby Justin42 on Sun Jan 15, 2006 10:56 pm

Firmware is just probably more highly optimized to burn at 8x... you'll find weird variations on ANY media. They may support burning at a variety of speeds, but they really tweak it to work best at some specific speed(s).
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Mon Jan 16, 2006 1:49 am

This is also ONLY basing your opinion off of the auto-generated CD/DVD Speed score.

Personally, I NEVER consider it. Reading graphs is more an art then a science.
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Postby hoxlund on Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:52 am

burning a verbatim DL in my plextor just for you guys

putting all my microsoft office/windows images on it, so should be pretty damn full
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Postby hoxlund on Mon Jan 16, 2006 11:22 am

18 minutes 21 seconds to burn, starting the scan, but i have to go to work
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Postby ItalianJob on Mon Jan 16, 2006 11:27 am

dolphinius_rex wrote:This is also ONLY basing your opinion off of the auto-generated CD/DVD Speed score.

Personally, I NEVER consider it. Reading graphs is more an art then a science.


Yeah, but score are quite low, meaning the max PIF are high.

Maybe your 1640 firmware is not the good one. There's too many buggy firmwares for the 1640 #-o
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Postby jberry on Mon Jan 16, 2006 11:44 am

well I am using version L, never went past that. I just found that the the scores were so variable depending on speed. I just tried another 8x burn with a score of 90, so I guess 8x is good for 1640. The first 8x burn has played flawlessly on 10 players so far. Only real issue is what happens at layer break, all have been superb. Again these are just my obervations...I will stick with 8x I guess. I have the graph of the original 8x sscore of 88....will post it when I return home.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:52 pm

ItalianJob wrote:
dolphinius_rex wrote:This is also ONLY basing your opinion off of the auto-generated CD/DVD Speed score.

Personally, I NEVER consider it. Reading graphs is more an art then a science.


Yeah, but score are quite low, meaning the max PIF are high.

Maybe your 1640 firmware is not the good one. There's too many buggy firmwares for the 1640 #-o


I haven't had a problem with any of the DW1640 firmwares yet... and even the complaints I've heard have been really very small compared to problems with the DW1620 and buggy firmwares. (and I could always compare to LiteON :P)
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Postby hoxlund on Mon Jan 16, 2006 7:55 pm

i didn't have time to do an entire scandisc, 84% done this morning and was still 100% perfect

ill check more when i get home

btw, burned with latest firmware on plextor 716 at the 6x speed

7990MB of data, so quite full

i would do a nice big DL retail movie, but you know me, i don't have any
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Postby ItalianJob on Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:43 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:I haven't had a problem with any of the DW1640 firmwares yet... and even the complaints I've heard have been really very small compared to problems with the DW1620 and buggy firmwares. (and I could always compare to LiteON :P)


I've heard a lot of problems with 1640 solidburn till the last firmware.

Fewer with 1600=>1620 pro (remember the free gift ?). Everyone has different thoughts, that makes the world go round :)
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Postby jberry on Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:52 pm

solidburn is not used on +R DL
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Postby jberry on Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:56 pm

Here is 4x....
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Postby jberry on Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:57 pm

and 8x...is a wide variation
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:39 pm

Yeah, I gotta admit, at those performance differences, I would probably burn at 8x too! :wink:
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Postby Ian on Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:50 pm

You gotta wonder why BenQ doesn't let you write to Verbatim's 2.4x DVD+R DL media at 8x with the DW1655.
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Postby jberry on Mon Jan 16, 2006 11:48 pm

2.4x score was 44 with 23000 PI Failures...bizarre
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:25 am

Ian wrote:You gotta wonder why BenQ doesn't let you write to Verbatim's 2.4x DVD+R DL media at 8x with the DW1655.


Because most drives (including BenQ DW1640's) do *NOT* get those kind of results at 8x. 4x is good, 6x is ok/good, but 8x is usually less then ok.

Pioneer suffers from the same problem with the DVR-110/D.
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Postby ItalianJob on Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:31 am

Well, I have seen better burns on 1640 and same DL media in a french forum

But the 1640 seems to give big variations on this media :(

Firmware BSNB : MKM001@4X
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Postby jberry on Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:13 pm

I have never got a 96 with DL!!!!! Maybe burned 20 in total.

What is REALLY aggrivating is that the manufacturers never given even an idea as to what a good speed is for DL....I never would have thought that 8x on my 1640 was the best speed (seems to be). If they are optimizing for that speed they really should tell us so we don't waste time and $. They could even have a disclaimer saying that not all drives will respond this way.....

why don't they do this in the release notes to firmware?
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:40 pm

jberry wrote:I have never got a 96 with DL!!!!! Maybe burned 20 in total.

What is REALLY aggrivating is that the manufacturers never given even an idea as to what a good speed is for DL....I never would have thought that 8x on my 1640 was the best speed (seems to be). If they are optimizing for that speed they really should tell us so we don't waste time and $. They could even have a disclaimer saying that not all drives will respond this way.....

why don't they do this in the release notes to firmware?


I know on Verbatim's part, they have told me that 8x is too fast, and their 2.4x DVD+RDL should not be burned faster then 6x, based on their own results. From my *OWN* testing, I'd agree, but from the results posted in this thread, I'd say some exceptions apply :wink:
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Postby ItalianJob on Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:49 pm

jberry wrote:I have never got a 96 with DL!!!!! Maybe burned 20 in total.


Maybe you've not the good firmware... Look the firmware in the pic. Would leave BSLB and try BSNB or more.
I didn't check all the changelog on the BenQ site to see if there is some improvment for DL since BSLB.

For info, that's what I get with my BenQ 1620 @4X with B7W9 and ImgBurn 1.1 :
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94+ scores are not so rare with MKM001.
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jan 17, 2006 1:05 pm

ItalianJob:

The scan DOES however show that there is a noticable problem with the second layer when compared to the first. Although the error rates themselves are nothing to be concerned with, it does speak of other potential things that could be wrong with the disc.
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Postby jberry on Tue Jan 17, 2006 1:22 pm

@dolph....

6x? Never had an option to burn at 6x....just 2.4, 4, 8
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Postby dolphinius_rex on Tue Jan 17, 2006 1:56 pm

jberry wrote:@dolph....

6x? Never had an option to burn at 6x....just 2.4, 4, 8


I don't think every drive can do it, but that's what Verbatim told me is their highest recommended burn speed. You'll notice on the packaging there's usually something that says "Up to 6x compatible with some drives!" or something like that.
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Postby ItalianJob on Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:07 pm

dolphinius_rex wrote:ItalianJob:

The scan DOES however show that there is a noticable problem with the second layer when compared to the first. Although the error rates themselves are nothing to be concerned with, it does speak of other potential things that could be wrong with the disc.


Well I read back this DVD+R DL booktyped to DVD-ROM on my (very) touchy now Philips DVD737 without any problems. There's "The Italian Job" on it, lol !

By the way, my LG 4166 1.01 can (theorically) burn DVD+R DL MKM001 @ 2.4X-4X-6X. Never tested, I'm waiting for some firmware before, at the current DL cost, lol !
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